david_horsager: Welcome to the trusted Leader show. it’s David Horsesgger, I have a special

david_horsager: guest with the day. He might be the most brilliant mind I know. on branding

david_horsager: and marketing. He’s been an executive and everything from Proctor and

david_horsager: Gamble, the coors Light to Red Robin to ▁quiz knows. he’s led some amazing

david_horsager: initiatives such as the I know it, ▁quiznos, the Sammy, uh, Sammy’s

david_horsager: initiative, or the the One million sub, Uh, Give away. He’s done some

david_horsager: innovative projects. He loves the farm like I do, and even as goats he lives

david_horsager: in this, this property that he is designed. I. he’s kind of architect on the

david_horsager: side, which is really cool. but he’s just a great down to earth guy and I

david_horsager: get to call him friend. So grateful to have you on Jerry O’brien.

gerry_obrion: Thank you so much for having me. This is fun. exciting.

david_horsager: Oh, this is. this is superbl. That’s all for my head. By the way, if I

david_horsager: actually would

david_horsager: have read a bio on you, we would be here for a long time. so um, anyway,

david_horsager: that’s uh. it’s It’s really cool and you’ve been traveling around the world.

david_horsager: You help people find there because you help people with branding and

david_horsager: marketing. You’ve been recently. were talking about it. I’ve got a good

david_horsager: flight of Vienna next week. You’re you’re in Bahrain. Um, you know recently,

david_horsager: or’re not even in your home city today, But um, let’s let’s jump in first of

david_horsager: all. Just kind of give us a a quick. Who’s Jerry O’brion.

gerry_obrion: so uh, you know it’s so funny. who’s Jerry Brown? grew in a small farm town in

gerry_obrion: Wisconsin, and now I travel all over, speaking to Ceo’s executive sales teams

gerry_obrion: about how to influence people to say yes to them. Whether it’s we need to

gerry_obrion: influence people to buy from us, which is a lot of what I do, But now even

gerry_obrion: more so, how do we influence employees to work for us? More and more people

gerry_obrion: are trying to figure out how do I become the employer of choice. How do you

gerry_obrion: influence people to work for you? Some companies, How do we influence

gerry_obrion: investors? You

gerry_obrion: know, and you know, you’ve got some politicians on here. How do you influence

gerry_obrion: people to vote for you? So I have a framework of influence that I’ve created

gerry_obrion: and honed over. Uh, thousands and thousands of of executives and sales teams

gerry_obrion: over the last decade, and that’s what I do now.

david_horsager: that’s so fun. Well, we’re going to jump in that. we’ll get personal a

david_horsager: little bit later, but I think we should just Stmp, jump into this framework.

david_horsager: I mean, I’ve heard you, Uh, we’ve been on the same stage together. You’ve uh

david_horsager: got an amazing message and I know you go deep in this in workshops and

david_horsager: consulting. But this whole idea about the because, First of all, give us a

david_horsager: little. you know that you, you say they buy your because, and may even

david_horsager: differentiate. There’s a lot about the Y these days, the y, and it seems

david_horsager: kind of similar, so maybe give us a little bit of the because. we’ll jump in

david_horsager: the framework in a couple of minutes, but just kind of that overall. And and

david_horsager: even how those two are different.

gerry_obrion: Yeah, absolutely so. so my framework is simple. You start with. who are you

gerry_obrion: trying to influence? What do you know about them? The insights Question One,

gerry_obrion: who are you trying to influence? Question too, what are your insights? What do

gerry_obrion: you know about what they want more of or less of, or really what they’re

gerry_obrion: hoping to achieve, or what they fear when they’re buying from you? Yp, Yup,

david_horsager: Okay, slow down. so go back to number one Really quick. Who are they? who is

gerry_obrion: who are they?

david_horsager: that who do you want Influence? Is it is that kids kind of influence them to

david_horsager: clean their rooms, Or is it you know

gerry_obrion: I? I always joke. It’s uh, influencing your kids to put the bulls face down in

gerry_obrion: the dishwasher, not face up. Yeah, so it?

david_horsager: there you go exactly, but in influencing influence start of sale influencing

david_horsager: constituents. Frankly, Republicans and Democrats here on the U S side of the

david_horsager: world, influencing others They. we, just you know a big bill was pass and

david_horsager: you had to have some from the other side, join each o each other’s side on a

david_horsager: few of other things, which is Um. So how number one it

gerry_obrion: who is your target? who are you?

david_horsager: is. who’s the target who? the audience? Number

gerry_obrion: who? who?

gerry_obrion: What are their insights Right? And this is great a political example. What do

gerry_obrion: they really care about? And there’s a lot of things going on that they care

gerry_obrion: about, everything from relection to serving their constituents to. Those are

gerry_obrion: all the things that they’re hoping for or what they fear right when you’re

gerry_obrion: influencing a customer to buy from you. What do they hope will happen if they

gerry_obrion: buy from you? What do they fear will happen if they buy from you even

gerry_obrion: another way? What do they fear will happen if they don’t buy from you? But

gerry_obrion: they buy from your competitor. They buy from some one else. So those that

gerry_obrion: mindse piece. Once you know who you’re trying to go after that mindset hopes

gerry_obrion: fears, uh insights. Then we get to question number three of the framework, I

gerry_obrion: know who I’m going after. I know what’s on their mind, what they care about.

gerry_obrion: what’s your outcome. What’s the promise you’re going to make? I’ll give you an

gerry_obrion: example here. if you

gerry_obrion: only promise an outcome. Here’s what’s in it for you. Here’s what’s in it for

gerry_obrion: you if you buy for me. If you only promise an outcome and you don’t what.

gerry_obrion: Finish, what I call the sentence of influence, and I’ll talk about your,

gerry_obrion: because is the ending of your sentence of influence. If you only make a

gerry_obrion: promise, we’ll give you an example. I’m Jerry. I’m goingnna open up a pizza

gerry_obrion: place and my marketing is this. Hey, come on into Jerry’s pizza. Our pizzas

gerry_obrion: Yeah, we. well, you know what we want. Better pizza. We all want better pizza.

gerry_obrion: We all want a better experience. we all want a better product. Hey, David, By

gerry_obrion: our product, it’s higher quality

gerry_obrion: right. Everybody says it. If you make a promise with no proof, you don’t

gerry_obrion: finish the sentence of influence, it, Y you get left hanging right. So the

gerry_obrion: question number before is your, because there’s great research out there. The

gerry_obrion: two thousand two Nobel prize winner in economics was not an economist who is a

gerry_obrion: psychologist that unravellled what happens in our brains when we make

gerry_obrion: decisions, And what he was able to show is that

gerry_obrion: your brain is looking for what I call a rational reason

gerry_obrion: to make the emotional decision. We have emotional side and a rational side of

gerry_obrion: our brains Right. And if we only give you the promise, Hey, our pizz’. Better,

gerry_obrion: our brain is looking for the proof. The, because, the ending of the sentence,

gerry_obrion: the rational logical side, I say, your brain needs a rational reason to make

gerry_obrion: the emotional decision. No, our pizza’ better because

gerry_obrion: take Papa Johns, for example, our pizza is better because we have better

gerry_obrion: ingredients. We never even look into what makes their ingredients better. But

gerry_obrion: they’ve finished the sentence of influence. That’s your. because, Question

gerry_obrion: three, your outcome, your promise question For what’s your? Because, what’s

gerry_obrion: your piece of proof And what we see, David in most marketing in most

gerry_obrion: companies, beat B be to C. Politicians, you name it, we don’t finish the

gerry_obrion: sentence of influence, we make you a promise, but we don’t give you any proof.

gerry_obrion: And if when we finish that sentence when we give you the proof, our products

gerry_obrion: are higher quality. That’s because

gerry_obrion: you can E, assure that you have better pizza. That’s because I was the brain

gerry_obrion: manager of Coor’s Light, I created one of the most famous becusses in the beer

gerry_obrion: industry. ever. Have you ever seen the bottle that turns blue when it’s cold

gerry_obrion: enough to drink? I launched.

david_horsager: this is. Yeah, that is an amazing story. I mean, I think it’s

david_horsager: let’s talk about this. I want an example story. Let’s talk about this

david_horsager: because you’ sitting there. You got these certain reasons people buy beer. I

david_horsager: wouldn’t be a good example. Here be cause I’m not a big beer fan. But, but

david_horsager: um, anyway, it’s what it’s call it

gerry_obrion: yeah, so so let me walk you through just really quickly. The framework. right.

gerry_obrion: So who are you going after? Well and beer? We’re going after twenty one to

gerry_obrion: twenty four year old men. Now people will say no, but older men drink beer.

gerry_obrion: women drink their. Yes, that’s all true. Seventy five percent of the beer in

gerry_obrion: the United States consumed by men, twenty one to twenty four year old men

gerry_obrion: drink eight times more light beer than all other men. They’re very high volume

gerry_obrion: users, so let’s just say we’re trying to influence men. Question one, twenty,

gerry_obrion: one, twenty four year old man, Question two, what are their insights? What do

gerry_obrion: they care about? We had eight insights about what people want from light beer.

gerry_obrion: They want it to be, Uh, you know, low calorie low carb. they wanted to be

gerry_obrion: socially acceptable, they wanted, they wanted to have funny advertising they

gerry_obrion: want. Uh, you know, Uh, all wants to be refreshing. They want it to be a good

gerry_obrion: value right, low price right, And then we found out they said Well, we want it

gerry_obrion: to be colder. We’re like great now. Just picture this, David.

gerry_obrion: Insight is we want our beer to be colder, Case of the outcome. Now the outcome

gerry_obrion: so your audience knows how to do this comes directly from your insights. If

gerry_obrion: the inside is we want colder beer. Our promise. our beer is colder.

gerry_obrion: Do you see how much that sounds like marketing fluff, and no one will believe

gerry_obrion: you. now. By the way, If I can make you believe that my beer is colder, you

gerry_obrion: guys can sell anything right.

david_horsager: two kids have

david_horsager: coming out of the same bridge, But I think what’s

david_horsager: interesting is basically what you said. The competitors met their light in

david_horsager: Budli. They basically had the other key insights covered.

gerry_obrion: yeah, so people say we wanted to taste Great Millerite from Nineteen seventy

gerry_obrion: Four has been saying Great taste less filling right. So they already had that

gerry_obrion: covered. Budlight was doing funny ads of dogs, frogs, spuds, Mackenzie horses,

gerry_obrion: All the funny things that they do funny ads socially party party beer. All

gerry_obrion: beer was being sold on emotion, but there was no pieces of proof right, so we

gerry_obrion: say. Oh, well, they say they want their beer to be colder. Well, how is our

gerry_obrion: beer going to be any colder than other beer in your same refrigerator? We

gerry_obrion: needed to find a. because, a piece of proof. So we created innovation after

gerry_obrion: innovation to give beer the same beer pieces of proof. The first thing we

gerry_obrion: launched was called the Frost brew liner. Can We put a blue liner inside the

gerry_obrion: can, David. The secret of the blue liner that’s inside the can is that every

gerry_obrion: can has a liner. They always have had one. They’re clear. Nobody knew they

gerry_obrion: were there. We turned ours blue and gave you proof that we were protecting the

gerry_obrion: refreshment of your beer. We sold an extra hundred million dollars of beer in

gerry_obrion: cans. The first year we made the blueliner. Then we came out with a bottle

gerry_obrion: that turns blue. The mountain’s turn blue when it’s cold enough to drink.

gerry_obrion: Notice that we didn’t uh, change the beer. We change the amount of information

gerry_obrion: you have about your beer. You know, when it’s cold enough to drink, People

gerry_obrion: want more certainty in their lives. Things like really important things. I

gerry_obrion: give my beer cold right. It is a big deal. when you’re drinking beer.

gerry_obrion: We created an incremental, two hundred and fifty million dollars a year in

gerry_obrion: sales. By finishing the sentence of influence. Your beer will be colder.

gerry_obrion: That’s our promise, because it’s got. It’ll be more refreshing because it’s

gerry_obrion: got a blue liner in the can. It’ll be cold enough to drink. That’s because the

gerry_obrion: mountains turn blue. when it’s cold enough to drink. We finished and gave you

gerry_obrion: pieces of proof in every business. Ninety five per cent of the companies I

gerry_obrion: work with be to bee companies. They’ve got a promise. they’ve got a product

gerry_obrion: that. It’s better. We need to give them the proof. And so that’s what

gerry_obrion: I. I spend my time doing with companies is four simple questions that change

gerry_obrion: everything. Now you asked about the why people say? Oh, I spent. I have c, e

gerry_obrion: Os. tell me this all the time. I spent all this time finding our Y. now,

gerry_obrion: David. I work in industries like attorneys, industrial moulds, technology

gerry_obrion: firms building out new technology. You name it. Do you know I work with a big

gerry_obrion: tire manufacture. Does any onee care why you sell tires?

gerry_obrion: Not one bit. They don’t care why you sell tires. They care what your tires do

gerry_obrion: for me, and what makes them different than every other tire on the road?

gerry_obrion: You’re intallars. What makes your installers of the tires different from all

gerry_obrion: the other installers that are out there? I’m not. I don’t really care why

gerry_obrion: you’re in a tre installer. I care what you do for me, and how you do that

gerry_obrion: differently, or better than every one else. the pieces of proof. So your’re

gerry_obrion: wise is the inspirational rallying cry behind why your company exists and why

gerry_obrion: people come to work every day Simon sent. It comes from the h. R side of the

gerry_obrion: business. It’s an inspirational, wonderful beautiful thing, especially when

gerry_obrion: you’re recruiting employees. But when it comes to people giving you the money

gerry_obrion: signing the twenty million dollar contract, they care about your, your proof.

gerry_obrion: You’re because. the reason why I believe you’re going to deliver this better

gerry_obrion: different than everyone else. That’s why they hand over the money. So that’s

gerry_obrion: the difference.

david_horsager: I. I think this is really interesting. so there is a four step P framework.

david_horsager: You know who you going after it is? I think number two the key insights and

david_horsager: I think some giving life to those. How do I find those key insights? I think

david_horsager: two think you said hopes and fears. But what are a couple of questions? I

david_horsager: would as to get the key insight

gerry_obrion: Yep, and people ask us all the time. How do you find out your insights in most

gerry_obrion: companies? D,

gerry_obrion: I came from Protctor Gamble. We drove everything based on insights from our

gerry_obrion: customers. We were famous for doing focus groups, deep dive, one on one

gerry_obrion: interviews, huge based surveys. The truth is the fastest easiest way to get

gerry_obrion: insights is talk to your customers. Become a listening organization. In my

gerry_obrion: book that’s coming out this spring. I do an interview with the guy that used

gerry_obrion: to be the C e o of the excavator division of Caterpillar,

gerry_obrion: And he tells this story about how he went around and no one was buying their

gerry_obrion: hybrid excavator, couldn’t figure out why he went to these c e os, these big

gerry_obrion: construction firms, and they told him everything they hated about his piece of

gerry_obrion: jug, hybrid excavator. He took it back to the engineering team, cancelled the

gerry_obrion: entire project. Uh, initiated a new project and it turned around the future of

gerry_obrion: the entire division of Caterpillar and the entire company

gerry_obrion: of Caterpillar, by listening

gerry_obrion: to customers frustrations, hopes, fears, um. what they want. more of what they

gerry_obrion: want less of,

gerry_obrion: And it’s not that hard to say. What do you like about our products? What do

gerry_obrion: you not like about our products? What do you like about our competitors

gerry_obrion: products? Here’s one forty, David. You want to get really good answers. Go to

gerry_obrion: a customer that used to work with you, left you and went to your competitor.

gerry_obrion: There’s where the answers

gerry_obrion: are. What did they say that got you to think they were a better solution for

gerry_obrion: you than we were. What mistakes did we make? What did they proactively do?

gerry_obrion: That was right. That convinced you. Um, and what are we? What are? What are we

gerry_obrion: doing that that? Now that you’re with them, that you wish that they were doing

gerry_obrion: insight, insight, insight. That’s what drives everything.

david_horsager: And that drives the. because,

gerry_obrion: Then, yeah, then yeah, then your. Your outcome is clear. Oh, you want this,

gerry_obrion: this, this and this, and what I generally do, David is what? What I do this

gerry_obrion: with the company. We’ll end up with thirty to sixty insights. Pieces of

gerry_obrion: information about what customers care about. Those will get narrowed to six to

gerry_obrion: ten that really drive decisions. Then you? That’s where you make your

gerry_obrion: outcomes. Your promises come from those top six, seven, eight insights. Now

gerry_obrion: they might be different throughout the sales process. The c e O might care

gerry_obrion: about something different than the C. f. O than the engineering team. There’s

gerry_obrion: all different insights you might be dealing with, but you take that and then

gerry_obrion: you turn it into a promise. What we hear you saying is you want this. We

gerry_obrion: promise this. That’s because you insert your piece of proof, Easy, easy, but a

gerry_obrion: lot of companies don’t do it

david_horsager: right, I can totally see it all over the place. Can you tell me a few

david_horsager: others? Can you give us a few more examples of like Papa Johns, Oh,

david_horsager: Thecause, we get it right away. Are there some other examples you can throw

david_horsager: out there? and I know everybody needs to know this by your people because

david_horsager: they buy you, because this is the book coming out this spring? Everybody

david_horsager: needs to be

david_horsager: looking for. We will be amplifying it and letting people know I love this

david_horsager: message. but by they bu, the bacause,

gerry_obrion: and you will start to see this everywhere. Wh, why I? You know if you’re

gerry_obrion: watching, you know football or whatever, and you’re watching T V ads. I know

gerry_obrion: everyone hates T V commercials, but watch one.

gerry_obrion: any T V commercial from a big major billion dollar brand will have pieces of

gerry_obrion: proof in it and you’ll see it all the time. Oh, because you know I. i. i, and

gerry_obrion: it’s great if you’ve ever seen like a a commercial for say, uh, uh, like

gerry_obrion: shampoo, and they’ve got the visual of how it’s going to go in and do. It’s

gerry_obrion: the little pieces of proof. Oh, there’s one Uh, that came out recently for

gerry_obrion: like an, an aspirin, or tylonolll, or something, And you’ll you’ll You might

gerry_obrion: even remember this. It says Because we have laser drilled holes. It like makes

gerry_obrion: your head it go away. laser drilled holes. Now, let me give you an example

gerry_obrion: that I just reminded me of myself of. I do this with my audiences. I say,

gerry_obrion: let’s take a low interest category. How about

gerry_obrion: floor mats for your car? Now, David. you’re an audience of one here. Can you

gerry_obrion: name any company that makes floormats for your car?

gerry_obrion: Okay, you can’t now in. I mean even tiny audiences. they always say one name

gerry_obrion: and all the all your listeners are reviewers are. S saying this right now,

gerry_obrion: Weather tech. Whether David weather tech, now you’ve heard of Weather Tech

gerry_obrion: floorliners, right, David?

gerry_obrion: Do you? And so we’re looking for there? Because now I want your audience to

gerry_obrion: think about this. Well, why would you buy and I asked my audiences this all

gerry_obrion: the time. Why would you buy a weather type floor liner versus any other floor

gerry_obrion: liner? And regularly they all say the same thing. Because, and if you’ve ever

gerry_obrion: seen one of their T V commercials, one hundred percent of their T V

gerry_obrion: commercials have this in them, they say, Because theyre laser measured

gerry_obrion: and you go. And And but what? Well, what’s the outcome? Well, the outcome is

gerry_obrion: it fits your car perfectly, so the snow and the mud stay in your car and not

gerry_obrion: on your carpet. That’s because weather tech flowor liners are laser measured

gerry_obrion: to fit your exact model of your car. Perfectly

gerry_obrion: okay. let’s be real, David. Do they really need to laser measure? No, they can

gerry_obrion: just get the speck from the car manufacture. I’m sure right, but no, that is

gerry_obrion: their piece of proof and they have built a massive company that now makes all

gerry_obrion: sorts of different products on one specific, because being because their laser

gerry_obrion: measured, and there’s example after example out there of people finishing the

gerry_obrion: sentence of influence, and a lot of times audiences will say well, Jerry do? I

gerry_obrion: just need one because, because it’s got a blue liner, because it’s laser

gerry_obrion: measured, Because we use better ingredients

gerry_obrion: in real companies that sell real things in complicated markets. You might have

gerry_obrion: six or eight different becauseuses that get used during your the course of

gerry_obrion: your sales process, depending on who you’re talking to. If you’re uh getting

gerry_obrion: out getting employees, you might have a few different becas. You might have

gerry_obrion: three or four, five different things that make your company special versus all

gerry_obrion: the other companies where people are considering Uh working. So what I want

gerry_obrion: the audience to think about is who are you influencing in the moment?

gerry_obrion: What are their insights and what is the pieces of proof that you can deliver

gerry_obrion: on those insights. Now that might vary throughout the course of your sales

gerry_obrion: process, There might be two or three things that person cares about and can

gerry_obrion: you deliver proof on each one of those things? The big mistake is making a

gerry_obrion: promise with no backup,

david_horsager: no proof.

gerry_obrion: no proof, because it sounds like fluff.

gerry_obrion: Ah, and so so you’re You’re in? I. I give this example of time and you’re in

gerry_obrion: the trust world. I mean, you’re the expert on trust.

david_horsager: Yeah, I got a little problem with you. You built the whole course thing

david_horsager: basically at, but it isn’t any cold than anywhere else. And yet you sold a

david_horsager: hundred million accent and it’s not real. It’s like you. Just you know.

gerry_obrion: I? Yeah, so, but the the worst thing you can say and people put this on their

gerry_obrion: websites. Hey, you should do business with us because you can trust us and

david_horsager: Yeah. No, just trust me that. Yeah, nobody trust the person that says. Just

gerry_obrion: your brain goes.

david_horsager: trust me

gerry_obrion: Just trust me Right until you give the piece of proof. Oh, you can trust us

gerry_obrion: because you know we special. I, I give an example of a tiny little auto repair

gerry_obrion: shop and here’s an example of how you can create A. because David tie little

gerry_obrion: lot, a repair shop. He opens up his doors and he serves in his sign. He

gerry_obrion: specializes David in two kinds of cars. The big sign says imports and

gerry_obrion: domestics, Yep, Brit’s pretty much everything right. And so he didn’t have

gerry_obrion: very many customers And then he realized the customers that were coming in the

gerry_obrion: neighborhood. A lot of them drove Audi and Volkswagens, so he ended up

gerry_obrion: specializing and narrowing his focus to say we specialize in Audiian

gerry_obrion: Volkswagens. Well then he got the big insight, he said Jerry. The big inside

gerry_obrion: is, there’s a lot of customers out there that don’t want to pay to go to the

gerry_obrion: dealership, but they do want to go to someone who specializes in their kind of

gerry_obrion: car. He tripled his business in eighteen months by narrowing his focus and it

gerry_obrion: get it. Get people are afraid of making a bad decision. And if you narrow your

gerry_obrion: focus and you do something specifically for them, Oh, you specialize in Audi

gerry_obrion: and Volkswagens, I can trust you. I believe you. I believe you can fix my car.

gerry_obrion: I believe you can probably fix my car more efficiently than someone else, and

gerry_obrion: I believe you’re going to be less pricey than the dealership specificity is an

gerry_obrion: of how you can create it because an increased trust and increased certainty

gerry_obrion: that you’re not making a bad call right. So

david_horsager: so good.

gerry_obrion: that’s Those are examples of how you can create a. Because, out of out of thin

gerry_obrion: air, really, and

david_horsager: Tell us the book titles going to be what the book titles going to be again.

gerry_obrion: it it’s go to be called, They buy. your. Because, closing the sale in a

gerry_obrion: crowded market, I work with a lot of industries that are very crowded. very

gerry_obrion: commodized. I mean plumbers, roofers,

gerry_obrion: home builders, um, techn. I mean technology. everyone is building the latest

gerry_obrion: greatest kind of technology Right. What makes yours? What’s makes your

gerry_obrion: identity verification different than the one down the down, the Internet,

gerry_obrion: right, Um, a law firms, I mean, everyone’s out there saying you know, we’ll

gerry_obrion: get you millions of dollars. What? Why am I going to pick one firm versus

gerry_obrion: another firm? Um, crowded crowded industries.

david_horsager: This is great and I’ve heard you before and seen this, and it just

david_horsager: brain bending for me. So there’s a lot more to us, but Jerry. We’re going to

david_horsager: get personal for a second before we do. Where can people find out about you?

gerry_obrion: What big brands? No Dot Com? So it’s a long, U. r. l. And if you type in

gerry_obrion: Jerry O’brion with an O n, o B r i o, n. I’m like the only one in the world.

gerry_obrion: So but what big brands know, Dot Com is my website. and uh, there’s videos

gerry_obrion: videos there. There’s a Bec video that. If you click on the little box on the

gerry_obrion: home page, Uh, it will take you through a five minute, um, live, uh session,

gerry_obrion: keenno, where I clipped out the because part because that’s what everyone

gerry_obrion: wants to see. I. I. I. I put it on Link, and it got like eleven thousand views

gerry_obrion: in the first week. I’m like. Wow, People really want

gerry_obrion: to know. This information is pretty fun.

david_horsager: well, you, you know, everybody can find out more than just go to trust the

david_horsager: Leader show Dot com. All kinds of show Notes from this episode links to Jerry

david_horsager: O’brion. We’re going to be seeing him more coming up. but let’s let’s uh,

david_horsager: just a a few minutes here on personal because I think I have a big belief.

david_horsager: Of course, all we deal with is is trust in leaders brands organizations

david_horsager: around the world, and most of the leaders I work with that are doing well

david_horsager: that are influencing others well, are also leading themselves well. So what

david_horsager: are you? What do you doing in Personally Mean you get. you got to be on some

david_horsager: big stage stages. You going to be in some significant boardrooms. What do

david_horsager: you? What do you do to lead yourself well personally, physically

david_horsager: emotionally. What do you know?

david_horsager: health wise? I don’t know.

gerry_obrion: yeah, so so you know I, I’ve been a runner since high school and all that

gerry_obrion: and physical and workout, But you know what has been great for me, David. and

gerry_obrion: you, uh, love animals and being out on the farm. And and so I have a little

gerry_obrion: property in Denver, Colorado. It’s in the metro, but it is a grandfathered

gerry_obrion: little horse property. but I don’t have horses. I’ve got four Nigerian dwarf

gerry_obrion: goats and I’ve got ducks and chickens and two behives and bunnies. that that

gerry_obrion: uh that run around the property. And uh, lately I learned here’s a piece of

gerry_obrion: trivia for you. Do you know what a group of rats is called? It’s called a y.

gerry_obrion: I. I had no idea I looked. It’s call a mischief. I have a mischief of pack

gerry_obrion: rats who have decided to live underneath my chicken feeding pens, so I’m

gerry_obrion: trying to figure out to do with them. So I have all these animals and what I

gerry_obrion: discovered especially drink covet. So I walk my goats and I live kind of in

gerry_obrion: the cities, But there’s dog, uh, trails and horse trails and all this stuff

gerry_obrion: all over the place. So I walk my goats and this is the funniest thing. I walk

gerry_obrion: them off leash. And you can see these people walking their dogs. They’re far

gerry_obrion: away and they’re looking. They’re going well, Gosh, Why is his animals awful

gerry_obrion: all off leash? And they get closer and they realize they’re not dogs. They’re

gerry_obrion: goats and then they’re like. I wonder if there’s a leash law for goats and

gerry_obrion: they nobody knows, And then they’re just so distracted by the fact that

gerry_obrion: there’s four goats walking along and then they all go Gosh. Your goats are

gerry_obrion: better off leash than my dog is on leash.

gerry_obrion: And so I spend a lot of time with my animals and walking with them and drink

gerry_obrion: covet. Especially, I realize it was so great for me. Like that connection to

gerry_obrion: animals is something I’ve discovered in the last few years and it has really

gerry_obrion: been emotionally a great balance for me.

david_horsager: fun. What about any? any resource? as far as input that you like to put in

david_horsager: either a good book lately or great podcast or something you’re putt in to

david_horsager: keep standing, fresh, relevant and capable. As far as you know what you’re

david_horsager: thinking about,

gerry_obrion: Well, you know what? I, um. I th. The truth is I don’t follow a lot of

gerry_obrion: podcasts and I get what I do from my c, e os that I’m I’m in in, literally

gerry_obrion: board roomoms every single week, and I’m get at keeping my pulse on the world

gerry_obrion: through people that that I’m interacting with, So I don’t spend a lot of time

gerry_obrion: uh with with listening to a lot of those things. I’m li. I’ve created a

gerry_obrion: listening organization of listening to the people on the front lines, and you

gerry_obrion: know and you, we’re all hearing the same things. How do I hire? How do I hire?

gerry_obrion: How do I hire

gerry_obrion: right? And that’s what’s going on right now for people. that. uh, so I don’t

gerry_obrion: have a great list of Re sources that I that I point people to.

david_horsager: No problem. So what about one big hope? Any, Any hope for the? let’s say the

david_horsager: next five or ten years for Jerry O’brion

gerry_obrion: Oh, yeah. well, I, the as I do. and this is something I’m going to ask for

gerry_obrion: David’s help with My framework has been honed for a decade. C, E O’s executive

gerry_obrion: sales teams are loving it and starting to implement it. Really, a many, many

gerry_obrion: companies are starting to implement the framework. I need to take that to the

gerry_obrion: next level so it can expand faster without me. So how my big hope is that I

gerry_obrion: get. I. The framework gets beyond me. Other people can start to implement and

gerry_obrion: help companies do it. Because it. it’s working and now I wanted to expand

gerry_obrion: beyond me. That’s that’s the last thing I want to do in my career. I want to

gerry_obrion: get this out there so everybody can use it and implement it because it works

gerry_obrion: and I don’t need to be the one to

david_horsager: Mhm, Mhm,

gerry_obrion: do it. I needed to be to live a life beyond Jerry O’brion. That’s my hope.

david_horsager: that’s been mine for two decades on trust Right, how

david_horsager: do we get the Pi framework and trust to go much beyond me And it’s been fun

david_horsager: to see that start to happen around the world. So

david_horsager: last question,

david_horsager: Remember trust the Leader show Dot com For the show, notes all the links to

david_horsager: Jerry’s cite, and exactly how to spell his name correctly,

david_horsager: and this a little bit more about this framework. So, last question it, the

david_horsager: trusted leader show who is the leader you trust and why?

gerry_obrion: I’m going to give you someone off the beaten path, someone that

gerry_obrion: most people probably haven’t heard of when I graduated from undergrad

gerry_obrion: University of Wisconsin. My first job ever was in in real estate appraisal, I

gerry_obrion: appraised manufacturing facilities all over the country, and the gentleman who

gerry_obrion: was the president of the company. His name is Andy Groonick. He was the kind

gerry_obrion: of leader who cared You knew he cared about you

gerry_obrion: about the individual about the person.

david_horsager: How do you know? how do you know?

gerry_obrion: Well, and it turns out that it’s really true because I worked for his company

gerry_obrion: for four years and I still have a relationship with him. In fact, he is a

gerry_obrion: leader that is, has gone beyond his original. He eventually sold the company

gerry_obrion: in La. Maybe three years ago, whatever the number of years goes, he ran for

gerry_obrion: governor for the state of Wisconsin,

gerry_obrion: And you know there was, you know, fifteen people in the primaries and he

gerry_obrion: didn’t make it all the way through to the end, But he would be a great leader

gerry_obrion: because he’s a leader beyond

gerry_obrion: it, it’s about the people and the things that matter. It’s not a. It wasn’t

gerry_obrion: never about the only about the money. it wasn’t about the business, it was

gerry_obrion: more about. I want to help you grow, and when I, I remember the day I told him

gerry_obrion: I was leaving the company and he couldn’t have been happier for me to go off

gerry_obrion: and go to business school and go to the next adventure. And he stayed in touch

gerry_obrion: with me for my whole life.

david_horsager: Hm, hm, hm, Hm,

gerry_obrion: A guy who’s the president of a company, the first one that ever gave you the

gerry_obrion: Yep, you get to work here, the first job straight out of school. That’s the

gerry_obrion: kind of leader I want to be. Somebody really actually cares about the people

gerry_obrion: and stays in touch with him. And it’s for real. It’s not just. Oh, you were

gerry_obrion: great while

david_horsager: Mhm, Mhm, Mhm,

gerry_obrion: you were here, but now I don’t care.

david_horsager: that is a good word. Well, Jerry O’brion thank you for being my friend.

david_horsager: Thanks for being on the show today. That has been the trusted leaders show

david_horsager: until next time, stay trusted.