David Horsager: Welcome to the trusted leader show it’s David Horsager i’ve got a special guest today my friend bill cates thanks for being with the bill.

Bill Cates: hey you’re welcome and and, by the way, in case anyone misheard it’s not Bill Gates.

Bill Cates: With the GI bill kate’s I missed it by one letter a few billion brain cells and a few billion dollars, but here’s the deal, David.

Bill Cates: Bill Gates made a lot of money now he’s on a mission to give it away my mission is to help you make more money and serve more people in the process.

David Horsager: that’s right you’re a giver to I know you so bill he’s you know you’ve written several books you’ve sold a couple of publishing companies in your lifetime you’ve.

David Horsager: you’ve been in a quite an adventure on the side the Himalayas tracking and climbing kilimanjaro and and camping in the Arctic Circle and and a whole lot of other things so.

David Horsager: This is going to be a whole lot of fun, most of our time, I want to spend on your new book radical relevance i’m so intrigued by this, I remember, I think you and I were talking about it at a coffee shop or place you know in DC.

David Horsager: But you know as you’re working on it and it was so fascinating then it’s it’s an exceptional book so radical relevance you’ll find everything about that in the show notes at trusted leader show calm.

David Horsager: But um you know before we get there, tell us tell us couple other things about you, what do we need to know about bill kate’s.

Bill Cates: Oh, Lord other than I love adventure travel planning a hopefully a machine mushing trip but dog sled tripped and Finland with a friend of mine, I got married recently kind of late in life January 3 2020 right before coven hit right.

Bill Cates: yeah so i’m traveling like crazy, the first couple of months and I didn’t really see my wife, for almost two months and people say hey bill how’s married life I said, well, we haven’t seen each other, much I guess it’s good you know it’s.

David Horsager: i’ll tell you something you know we because of traveling everything we’ve had some been fortunate with what we do and you and i’ve done some similar things traveling around the world world work on six continents and so we’ve gotten to take some spring breaks different places.

David Horsager: And finally, it was a few years ago, you know i’m in i’m a minnesotan and I said I have been traveling so much this year spring break we are staying home we’re gonna be minnesotans.

David Horsager: So we went up to northern Minnesota we went.

David Horsager: mushing in Minnesota it was on believable then we went ice fishing for it, then we went to the hockey hall of fame and Evelyn Minnesota then we went to.

David Horsager: Have a Friday fish dinner at this little community and hitting Minnesota the iron range and anyway, we did miss up, but when we look back on maybe our favorite spring break it was right in our own back your yard and was mushing and stay in a year, and it was amazing so.

Bill Cates: yeah yeah that’s that sounds very minnesotan.

David Horsager: yeah sure you betcha.

David Horsager: So tell me, you know before we get into this you’ve been in relationship marketing, for a long time you you sold your their first companies, I might even come back around to that, but.

David Horsager: As far as publishing companies but tell me what what’s I think people have different views of what’s relationship marketing.

Bill Cates: yeah so and lately, you know there’s been a kind of a convergence of the traditional if you want to call that relationship is more of the traditional and the digital so i’m kind of calling it tread digital.

Bill Cates: But even in the digital things that we work on they’re still the relationships so, for instance.

Bill Cates: we’re always thinking in the the warmest source, what is the warmest way to reach prospects.

Bill Cates: What is the warmest way to attract we always want to start in the warmest place you know a lot of people get caught up in doing.

Bill Cates: Facebook ads and linkedin this and using the the bots that will get you kicked off a linkedin and all that right.

Bill Cates: But and i’m not saying that that doesn’t have a place for some folks but how would someone prefer to meet you most of the businesses that I work with and consult with.

Bill Cates: Their ideal clients would prefer to meet them through a warm source someone they already trust we want to use that borrowed trust.

Bill Cates: So referrals personal introductions social event marketing centers of influence, all the different ways we use the existing relationships in our life to get what we want to get done.

Bill Cates: And what I say to folks if you’re trying to meet someone or you know meet certain types of people or get it problem solve.

Bill Cates: Look at your relationships first right that should be your first Google search, if you will, is what what relationships, do you have in place and odds are if you’ve got a problem you know, someone has had the same problem they’ve figured out you just got to get connected to those people.

David Horsager: By the way, you did it a big event from a whole Minnesota group just a week ago and they I was hoping to be there, but they said, you did a fantastic job speaking of relationships that told me directly.

David Horsager: So.

Bill Cates: When I show, and I did miss you there I you were conspicuously absent Oh well, thank you.

David Horsager: So you know you’ve been a generous giver I think that’s a part of relationships is that you are giving you’re helping you’re connecting you’re adding value.

David Horsager: But we got to jump into this book because i’m really excited about it radical relevance sharpen your marketing message cut through the noise when more ideal clients why this book and why now.

Bill Cates: yeah well why this book there’s two main reasons there’s two main barriers to meeting people building our businesses and one is the marketing message overload.

Bill Cates: Right, so we do have to cut through all that noise people have erected all kinds of barriers to keep all the noise out right because so much isn’t relevant.

Bill Cates: And anything that isn’t relevant they want to ignore and if it’s slightly relevant they still want.

Bill Cates: It so that’s one of the obstacles that were one of the reasons I wrote the book, the other.

Bill Cates: Is it is inertia right people are either moving in a certain direction they’re resisting change they’ve got their head down they.

Bill Cates: They don’t want to take the time to look at a new option, even though the option may be better they may have problems that they need to solve but they’re moving so dang fast.

Bill Cates: That they’re just kind of willing to live with those problems because of the speed or on the flip side there they’re just stuck right there, doing nothing they’re confused.

Bill Cates: And if they’re confused they’re not going to move forward, this is by the way, all of this we’re talking about also works inside an organization it’s not just.

Bill Cates: An external marketing your product but, and we can get to that, but in any event, those are the two main things that I wrote the book is how do we reach people, how do we get them to listen to our message.

Bill Cates: And then, how do we get them to move and to take the action that’s in their best interest right what’s always going to be concerning that it’s in their best interest to do that.

David Horsager: I think you know we talked about the eight pillars of trust, all the time, and you, you hit it on out of the park on to.

David Horsager: Maybe on all of them, but I to really stood out and one is clarity, people have so much issue with clarity, we know that people trust the clear and they miss trust or distrust the ambiguous or the overly complex, most people aren’t.

David Horsager: And the other pillar you hit it on the out of the park on and and you just do this in life and that’s the connection pillar connecting and collaborating we, we have to connect with people to market well let’s jump to one.

David Horsager: Part I think is fascinating and that is, you have a different view of value propositions from the inside.

David Horsager: Like let’s be clear there, because if we’re clear there you have a chance at being clear outwardly Can you help explain that.

Bill Cates: yeah so a lot of people I believe confused and maybe it’s just semantics, but.

Bill Cates: people think when they think of value proposition they think of elevator pitch they think of that short succinct way to talk about our value, and we, and we do need to have a short succinct way to talk about it for certain circumstances.

Bill Cates: But in my mind the value proposition is really from the minute you meet a prospective client onboarding them serving them ongoing.

Bill Cates: Everything you do the questions you asked the things you teach the service you render that’s that’s your value proposition that’s where all the points.

David Horsager: That seems too vague and ambiguous, how do I get clear about that.

Bill Cates: Well, first of all, one of the things I help organizations do the ones who wanted begin with this or that is get everybody in the organization, or at least key people.

Bill Cates: And dig through all of that, and really figure out what are all the points of value and it’s amazing how people.

Bill Cates: buy into the mission and the vision of the business when they get in touch with all the places we provide value, because you know employees.

Bill Cates: They won’t have a sense of the work that they’re doing to that external customers, making a difference for those people right and.

Bill Cates: And so, when you get in touch with your full value proposition everyone gets on the same page actually people get excited about the work they do.

Bill Cates: And then from there you do start to narrow it down a little bit you start to think about all right, what do we want to communicate what’s going to resonate best with our prospective customers and customers.

Bill Cates: And from there, we draw the shorter more succinct ways of talking about our value.

Bill Cates: But first we do that big work and and it’s just better you don’t have to do that, to come up with ways to talk about your business but it’s better work.

Bill Cates: And then, what I always recommend is you take this work that you’ve done and then you talk to some of your customers or clients.

Bill Cates: You know, in my book radical relevance, I have the 17 rules of radical relevance and number two is give your clients or customers a seat at the table.

Bill Cates: And many businesses do that with you know advisory boards and things like that larger businesses do it with focus groups but that’s critical, we should never develop this in a vacuum.

Bill Cates: Right, we should never we we have a good sense of what people want but it’s not exactly what they want, and we want to hear it from them because we’re going to come up with words and phrases that we wouldn’t even think of that our clients customers prospects, think of.

David Horsager: hmm if you when you see a company and they kind of put all these values, you know when you see employees get excited like what’s something that.

David Horsager: is sometimes surprising to a to an employee to say.

David Horsager: Oh, I didn’t even know we offer that feeling i’m so excited to be a part of this group because look at this we offer this value I didn’t even really say in the mission statement or or no or see and now that I do, I feel I feel more a part of this.

Bill Cates: yeah so it’s a couple of places one is is the problems that we solve for our clients or customers a lot of times the employees don’t realize.

Bill Cates: The state of affairs that that someone comes to us in and their confusion and their uncertainty and the problem that they’re facing.

Bill Cates: Whether it’s bleeding money or or whatever it might be, and a lot of the internal folks don’t know that they don’t see the full picture.

Bill Cates: And so, where they see how they really helped that that company that person, but even more so, is they see how that affects a lot of other people so, for instance.

Bill Cates: One company that I consult with up in Canada works with a lot of CEOs a lot of leaders and they help the leaders become better leaders.

Bill Cates: And that’s cool and that’s neat and but one of the things they weren’t really fully grasping that I think I helped them with a little bit is that when they help leaders get better.

Bill Cates: That helps everyone in the organization right because a better leader, a more enlightened leader, a more rested leader, you name it.

Bill Cates: Effects impacts, the lives of hundreds, thousands of people right and so when they see that full impact of their value that’s what they get excited about that.

Bill Cates: And the other little place is sometimes a lot of people don’t realize how much we can often help people aren’t even clients or customers yet.

Bill Cates: Just in the prospect experience justin that you know that determining are we a fit, are you a fit this it makes it a courtship.

Bill Cates: We bring a lot of value and we help and a lot of people get very excited about that, because they didn’t realize how we help people who don’t even become customers or clients.

David Horsager: I think the key there is like I think something I hope our our team is proud of, is how we do things the way we do it, it matters so it’s like.

David Horsager: hey i’m proud to be here because we do it differently than that we we had something where.

David Horsager: Just today, we had a big contract come in and that’s when we said hey we made a place for this smaller kind of nonprofit thing that we committed to.

David Horsager: So we don’t just go tell them.

David Horsager: up not doing this we’re going to take this big amount we’re gonna we keep this commitment and them, seeing that it’s like I love being a part of this, where we keep commitments, where we.

David Horsager: Do we say I mean I think there’s a thing, and how we treat people how we treat each other how we, you know I think people love to be a part of not that we certainly don’t do it perfectly I think there’s something there.

Bill Cates: Well, in you know in my in when I talk about referrals and introductions it’s quite often not the product or the service or the core service that makes you referral.

Bill Cates: it’s it’s the process of doing business with you it’s a process of learning about the product and the service that you offer it’s the process of the delivery of all of that so.

Bill Cates: We need to make two types of connections with our clients or customers, we got to make a value connection we got to make a personal connection.

Bill Cates: The value connection questions you ask things you teach responsive service all that sort of good stuff.

Bill Cates: But then the personal connection how we interact with people how we, you know, keep our commitments, how we apologize if we make a mistake that whole how we create business friendships sometimes along the way.

Bill Cates: that’s what makes us referral and that’s what makes the experience worth talking about the other people it’s the process.

David Horsager: that’s so good, you know you talked about something we were on problems, a moment ago, you talked about the difference between aspirational versus critical.

David Horsager: problems.

David Horsager: Tell us about that.

Bill Cates: yeah so I actually got this from a gentleman by name of Michael Scott, out of Boston and.

Bill Cates: it’s the last chapter in my.

Bill Cates: book and.

Bill Cates: He outlines a graph think of it this way, so we got.

Bill Cates: that everyone is sitting on problems that are latent they don’t know they have the problem.

Bill Cates: And they’re in there either critical or their aspirational right, so if we have a problem that we don’t know about well we don’t know about it and so we’re not going to do anything about.

Bill Cates: Right so sometimes some people in the sale and marketing of products and services, we have to inform people to help them realize there is this issue there is this problem.

Bill Cates: But if it’s aspirational if it’s something they’re going to get to someday yeah i’ll do that eventually yeah yeah they might act they might not and some people will act on aspirational things.

Bill Cates: We don’t leave it out, but if it’s critical if there’s a deadline if they’re bleeding money if they’re in some sort of pain.

Bill Cates: And if it’s a B2B sale there’s a corporate pain and then there’s the personal pain that they’re feeling they’re under a lot of pressure, whatever right.

Bill Cates: They will move heaven and earth to solve a blatant critical problem, so we either want to organize our business around blatant critical problems, so that we go out to the market.

Bill Cates: Serving people who know they have the problem, or we better have a good educational process a way to help them realize.

Bill Cates: The problem is, is there and that it’s a critical problem, or we may not move people we’re going to be frustrated I just got off a consulting call with a firm around that.

Bill Cates: And people too many people are putting them off they’re doing this first and we got to do this, first we got to do this first so they’re not showing the critical nature and the cost of doing nothing.

Bill Cates: Right, sometimes we have to ask what happens if we do nothing, and if it’s an aspirational problem they’ll say well not not much you know i’ll live with it, but yeah.

David Horsager: I mean I this is so critical and not to say.

Bill Cates: critical but not overdo it or not.

David Horsager: This is why we’re we’re way more motivated by pain than pleasure oh you’ll give me 20 bucks I might come up and get it oh you put a tack on my seat out i’m jumping you know it’s like we’re so much more motivated by pain to act.

Bill Cates: I would say that’s true yes and the brain is is geared that way so and but we don’t want to discount the aspirational Let me explain so in Chapter three of my book is the neuroscience of relevance.

David Horsager: I wanted to get to that.

Bill Cates: yeah and I hurt my brain right in the chapter, but and I had three neuroscientist who I consulted with to make sure I was getting it right.

Bill Cates: Because had you write one chapter on neuroscience but, nonetheless, one thing I learned a lot of things one was that the brain every six times a second.

Bill Cates: Is scanning right it’s unconscious obviously where Am I am I safe where that’s the keep the body, the organism alive.

Bill Cates: And then, three times a second it’s going is there an opportunity squirrel right, so the brain is built for opportunity to build the brain is built to take advantage of new things, but only when it feels safe.

Bill Cates: So that’s why in marketing and expressing our value, and this is also internal in an organization if we’re trying to get people to buy into our ideas internally.

Bill Cates: We first have to help people feel safe they, we have to show that we have empathy understanding appreciation for the challenges that they’re facing.

Bill Cates: Because they want to fix those first and then usually the aspirational and the goal is that’s kind of the really just the other side of the same coin.

Bill Cates: Right you solve this problem, and then they get freed up for the aspirational same thing with maslow’s hierarchy right you got to fix these critical things first before you can think in terms of self self actualization right.

Bill Cates: So both of those are important, and so what I tend to do is in my marketing and my influence work.

Bill Cates: I tend to start with an empathy for someone’s situation and problems and they that they want to fix need to fix.

Bill Cates: But I don’t forget about the things they also want to accomplish and and their goals and their aspirations, because you never know exactly what’s going to trigger their attention and motivation.

Bill Cates: Because a lot of people are motivated by the aspirational, so I do both you just and then you’re hitting the whole brain right.

David Horsager: yeah exactly you know you talk about something, you know that, and this is, we all have problems and you kind of give a framework for solving problems, but you you, you talk about.

David Horsager: How to even determine this kind of this model for solving problems determining the problems to solve, for clients or or businesses right to give us a little bit of a hint inside of that.

Bill Cates: yeah so the whole thing of radical relevance is is just a relentless pursuit of getting to know our prospects and clients it’s and you know when pandemic kit it became more important than ever before, and the businesses that actually thrived.

Bill Cates: into the pandemic and hopefully knock on wood beyond are the ones who took that time to go back to their customers or clients and say.

Bill Cates: Look we’re all going through a challenge to hear what are your biggest challenges, what do you need right now.

Bill Cates: Forget about what we do, what do you need maybe we can help you maybe we can introduce you to someone who can help you right, I want to focus on you now what happened.

Bill Cates: Is a lot of clients, I worked with in other businesses, so I interview for the work I do.

Bill Cates: they’re getting more referrals than ever before, more unsolicited referrals than ever before, because they took that time.

Bill Cates: To truly listen to what the the clients situation was what the problems were.

Bill Cates: And not just what the corporate problem was, but how does that that person, how are they relating to the problem there’s always two levels to that problem.

Bill Cates: And you know, Donald Miller and story brand right and he talks about the the villain is kind of the external problem that that person and the company faces.

Bill Cates: But then there’s the internal internal part of that and getting to know the person.

Bill Cates: The nice thing about the pandemic, I mean there’s a lot of bad things about it, obviously, but one of the neat things is is a lot of people became more transparent, more vulnerable, if you will, and just more real right and all that.

David Horsager: fun, as you know, they got you got the CEO with the four year old with they’re running behind with their undies and they got the cat jumping on the computer.

Bill Cates: it’s true I I when I watched my daughter’s cats you walk by a black cat walking by the middle of a of a you know, a virtual presentation I warn people.

Bill Cates: But that that happened and that’s a good thing, I think right, because I think that’ll that little piece that little forgiving aspect.

Bill Cates: I don’t think we’ll ever go away, I think I think we’re going to be a little more forgiving of people when it comes to this sort of stuff so.

Bill Cates: You know back to the problem issue is one of the things we need to do when we discover someone has a problem.

Bill Cates: Is, we need to figure out of course what the impact of the problem is right, how is that impacting the company, how is that impacting you.

Bill Cates: And then we keep asking tell me more tell me more get deeper and deeper because there’s layers of an onion and then we get to the essence and that’s when we can come in and really be that guide and help that.

David Horsager: So walk me through that let’s just take.

David Horsager: What I got a problem, how do I get to that you, it looks like this first like take somebody as an example, like it looked like this, and when the the essence looked like this, like what was the difference between the outward showing and with the essence being.

Bill Cates: yeah Okay, so one of the companies that I work with in Canada, where we help them go from 100 clients to 1000 clients in seven years.

Bill Cates: And we’re talking about $10,000 a year per client or more so that’s a big piece of growth.

Bill Cates: what they were doing when they first got started is they were kind of thing on the surface, they were saying you know.

Bill Cates: This is it you know it’s lonely at the top, being a CEO it’s you need more people around you to to help you and feel more camaraderie and all that, and you know what that attracted a lot of people.

Bill Cates: And that was really good however there’s always there’s always deeper parts to that so, then you say, well, tell me more about that right my my favorite phrase in life and business is tell me more.

Bill Cates: yeah right someone says yeah this is this is causing an issue I you know i’m sorry to hear that tell me more well you know my employees are now they’re just or i’m getting.

Bill Cates: Pressure from the board all right well tell me more about that what’s that looking like and they’ll talk a little bit more.

Bill Cates: And then and and and then, of course, you know i’m working too many hours and so i’m getting home i’m getting pressure from my spouse to and sorry about tell me more about that and so just this tell me more and and other questions like, why is that important to you.

Bill Cates: Or why is that important to your organization, these are the digging kind of questions that a lot of people don’t ask they stay on the surface and.

Bill Cates: It doesn’t mean you can’t be of some value to those people, but relevancy is all about context, so the more context we have about someone and accompany.

Bill Cates: The better we can serve them and some of that context we get from you know the work we do before we meet them the research we do.

Bill Cates: From the referral source from the Internet and then most of the the in depth context we get is from from helping these people discover.

Bill Cates: discover how they feel about it sometimes they’re running so fast they don’t even realize how it’s impacting them.

Bill Cates: And so that’s what I mean by getting to the essence of the problem and that’s, by the way, how we often get to that critical nature of the problem right, because when they say you know if I don’t fix this the board of directors is probably going to let me go right.

Bill Cates: that’s what a CEO could say and alright, so now they’re feeling it right, and maybe they never made it to even to themselves before they kind of had a sense of it, but when they speak it out it’s like it becomes real.

Bill Cates: And that’s when people will move heaven and earth to fix the problem and so that’s I hope that makes sense I yep that’s.

David Horsager: that’s fantastic I can remember a senior leader saying to me, you know $300 billion organization saying.

David Horsager: here’s The bottom line David I haven’t told anybody this, but I feel the weight of the world in the pit in my stomach every morning when I wake up with the responsibility of this work so.

David Horsager: there’s so much more in this book, I want to touch on to other things that stood out and that you know.

David Horsager: We could we could go anywhere, people can get it radical relevance and I think interestingly, a lot of what you’re saying is as well, some of it is simple people don’t do it it’s listening listen to your clients listen to your customers listen to your.

Bill Cates: People.

David Horsager: You know, no doubt about it, but you talk about the dear sweet strategic and tactical relevance yeah tell me about that.

Bill Cates: yeah so strategic relevance are kind of the big decisions right or the bigger decisions like who fits and who doesn’t fit your business.

Bill Cates: Who are you trying to attract and who you no longer trying to attract and every business needs to.

Bill Cates: visit this from time to time, and so within that is the target market, what is your target market are you clear on that what is the bullseye in that market.

Bill Cates: Right and when I say bullseye that we call them right fit clients, some people call them ideal personas avatars is a lot of words, that people bandy about around this.

Bill Cates: But it’s clarity around that and and you’re right clarity is is prime, by the way, there’s brain science around that because the brain is trying to keep the organism alive alright, so the brain is trying to expand fewer calories right, even though we’re trying to you know.

Bill Cates: burn calories to lose weight, or whatever right, but the brains fighting against us.

Bill Cates: And anytime it comes across a message.

Bill Cates: that’s confusing uncertain guess what the brain resist going there, I mean it can you can go there and figure it out, but the brain doesn’t want to go there because it’s not clear and and brain wants clarity, as you said right.

Bill Cates: So yeah so so we’ve got to make sure that at every step of the long way way where we’re being clear on what we want, who we want to serve how we reach those people, etc, so that’s kind of the strategic side of things.

Bill Cates: The tactical is really, of course, the implementation of that so, for instance.

Bill Cates: reaching out to prospective clients now we’re in a little bit of the sales mode here right where, how do you differentiate yourself from competitors, you can have strategic differentiation but eventually it comes down to the tactical.

Bill Cates: How do you separate yourself from someone specially you know, one of the biggest obstacles we face in the sales and marketing cycle is is the incumbent.

Bill Cates: The person is already in place serving that particular prospect, how do we separate ourselves from that person, without making that other company look bad.

Bill Cates: Because you don’t want to question the decisions that your prospect has made you don’t want to say look, you know you chose is wrong company because there’s.

David Horsager: One idea how would I do it.

David Horsager: I gotta go in that guy’s been selling there forever they kind of like him Okay, but how am I going to unseat the income and I have something better.

Bill Cates: yeah so first of all it’s getting to know your your your the world that you’re serving and then getting to know your prospect, the best you possibly can.

Bill Cates: And that’s working through referrals and personal introductions as you best you can, which is what i’ve been teaching forever.

Bill Cates: But even if you don’t meet them through referral it’s doing a lot of homework and really getting to know, and so, then you quite often do up to the questions you ask.

Bill Cates: So the biggest the biggest thing and sales and marketing is empathy empathy is not the same as sympathy empathy is understanding of and appreciation for someone situation.

Bill Cates: And we can often demonstrate our knowledge and our awareness and appreciation for their situation to the questions we ask.

Bill Cates: So that’s one way to separate ourselves a little bit and demonstrate, we know them but i’ll give you a specific formula.

Bill Cates: And I got this from Karen cop, who wrote a book called biz Dev done right and she’s a colleague of ours and our association and I feature this in my book radical relevance and it goes like this we’re going to get super tactical here, anyone can only we can, for example.

Bill Cates: or a lot of people can very few can, for example, all right so look any any consultant any sales trainer can talk about trust and building trust and they do.

Bill Cates: But we.

Bill Cates: Are the only firm that actually puts out an annual trust report where we do empirical you know validated statistical research that draws the straight line between trust and the dollar and all the stuff that you guys do right so i’m kind of using you.

Bill Cates: i’m butchering it i’m sure.

David Horsager: it’s great we are.

Bill Cates: Right and then and then, for example on the, for example, is very important because whatever you might say about what you do and how you might do a little differently.

Bill Cates: You need to bring it to life, you need to make it real for people and it’s the, for example, and that’s where I share a little mini case study.

Bill Cates: Right, for example, here’s how it shows up right with a client, the other day, or we do this trust study could be the, for example.

Bill Cates: And so that’s a way that we separate ourselves anyone can, but only we do this right, and if you do something in a way that that other firm doesn’t do, that is a clear benefit to the prospect that’s got to be translated to a benefit then they’re going to go oh.

Bill Cates: Tell me more.

Bill Cates: And it’s hard to rustle.

Bill Cates: people away from the you know the the incumbent because sometimes the devil they knows better than Dell they don’t know and.

Bill Cates: And here here goes your trust stuff right you got to build that trust and credibility and connection and all those things that you talk about goes hand in hand with it with the stuff that I talked about there’s no it.

Does.

David Horsager: I love it wow we could go all day on this it’s fantastic just just let’s get personal for a second you know your your lifelong learner.

David Horsager: you’re you’re you’ve built.

David Horsager: Business for 40 years what what are you learning now what’s new.

Bill Cates: What am I learning now well i’ll tell you I read a quote recently from vince lombardi and some people will be old enough to remember vince lombardi the coach of the green Bay packers, and this is stuck with me and it served me well, and he said fatigue makes cowards of us all.

Bill Cates: And so you know, David when i’m getting into a negative spin of thoughts and we all get there, from time to time I don’t care how positive, we are an optimistic that we are we get to that.

Bill Cates: And then I just take a timeout and I go on being negative what’s going on here i’m tired.

Bill Cates: And just that awareness of the fact that i’m being tired i’m turning into a wimp i’m turning negative and then I just do something different, I go listen to music i’ll you know just a break the state.

Bill Cates: And i’ll get into something different so that’s one big lesson, let me give you another one.

Bill Cates: And everybody kind of knows this, but.

Bill Cates: What you put your attention on and grow stronger in your life right now Earl Nightingale and the strangest thing and strangest secret years ago said what you think about you become.

Bill Cates: And gosh, the more we become aware of that, the more we focus on it and there’s an there’s a related to that that clear intentions produce clear results vague intentions produce vague results.

Bill Cates: Right when we’re clear then guess what happens, we start making different decisions we start taking action in subtle ways that we don’t even know that we created that to ourselves.

Bill Cates: Because of our clarity and so we’re going to draw the right things to us when we’re clear and when we stay focused there’s a consistency of focus and clarity, they work together so that’s what i’ve been learning and thinking about, and you know, putting into.

Bill Cates: Practice in my own business.

David Horsager: wow we can’t beat that.

David Horsager: Mic drop.

David Horsager: Here we go.

David Horsager: He makes cowards of us all.

David Horsager: it’s true intention equals clear results they contention egos vague results and a whole lot more hey for everybody out there.

David Horsager: You can find out more about bill kate’s all of his books and his newest book radical relevance at trusted leader show.com you’ll see the show notes there’s everything about bill the things that he’s mentioned or everything he wants to have public facing.

David Horsager: is true right.

David Horsager: So trusted leader show calm we’ll put in the show notes.

David Horsager: This has been fantastic last question, we asked everybody it’s the trusted leader show who is a leader you trust and why.

Bill Cates: You know, David I knew you’re gonna ask me this and, and you know my first thought was politics and i’m going i’m not going there.

Bill Cates: Because, even if I think of somebody who’s going to divide half of the listening audience, so why even go there.

Bill Cates: And now and in the then a name popped into my mind is someone you know someone, no one has heard of on this podcast i’m pretty sure.

Bill Cates: And it’s a gentleman by the name of Barry banter and Barry is the current chairman of the board of the national speakers association.

Bill Cates: NSA not not not the NSA that you’re thinking about they’re, the ones who listen were the ones who talk and.

Bill Cates: But he’s the chairman of the board, and when I think of integrity and I think of someone I can trust and has the perfect mix.

Bill Cates: Of a little bit of spiciness and a sense of humor and a little interesting history, but with a mild trusting steady intellectual manner.

Bill Cates: Right, you need a little bit of both a little bit of spice and a little bit of that, and you know there that that’s one of the guys I go to battle with right, I know, one of the guys that I would trust to be holding the rope for me when i’m hanging off the edge of the of the cliff.

David Horsager: And everybody in in those Barry banter would be like oh yeah I didn’t think of it absolutely.

Bill Cates: We got maker here’s this right.

David Horsager: Exactly I mean it’s like wow and, by the way, he’s trusted by some of the wealthiest people in the world.

David Horsager: As far as personally because he’s confidential he’s private in the appropriate ways he’s he’s and he’s brilliant so that’s a great one there’s a lot more, we could say, Mr Bill kate’s what a treat i’m thankful.

David Horsager: To call you my friend and i’m grateful for your wisdom you’ve made me better and you continue to, and so I want to thank you especially for coming today, this has been the trusted leader show until next time stay trusted.