David Horsager: Welcome to the trusted leader show it’s David Horsager I have a special guest she is a friend she’s the founder of savvy you she’s also been.

David Horsager: A senior consultant for us that trust edge and the trust as leadership institute she’s amazing she is a wnba champ.

David Horsager: And she’s been that for over 22 years with the Minnesota lynx she’s a passionate leader she’s a mentor of many please welcome my friend, Michelle Backus thanks for being here.

Michelle Backes: thanks for having me David i’m excited it isn’t you.

David Horsager: Oh, this is gonna be great i’m so excited to hear what you’re doing these days, and I know you still been doing some things for us but tell us about savvy you you’re you’re jumping right in actually before that just tell us something about you.

Michelle Backes: about me well, I am an empty nester I guess that’s, the first thing that came to mind so both my kids are off in college right now so we’re on a my husband RON and I are on the great reset we’re calling it.

David Horsager: wow and what have you done what’s something you’ve done to reset.

Michelle Backes: Oh man we’ve done everything from blood panels health wise to new routines around the House and we just had a lot of fun planning some patients we’ve been doing some adventures did a knee surgery in there for RON.

David Horsager: RON is a what was a former while he’s he’s quite an athlete but, as a former Olympian shot put her too and you’ve both were and are athletes and you’ve created athletes it’s quite a quite a quite a journey you’ve been on and in many different ways, but.

David Horsager: let’s let’s jump in here because I want to hear about savvy you that’s a that’s a new.

David Horsager: Really passion for you about transforming lives and people in fact you just had a you’re telling me about an event, you had this weekend, so I want to hear about that tell us about savvy what’s what’s the what’s behind that.

Michelle Backes: Well, I have this wonderful position with the trust edge leadership institute that.

Michelle Backes: was affected by coven as far as flying around and sharing this message and for you as well, and so during this time I saw an opportunity, just to put together some of the things I was also doing on the side with.

Michelle Backes: helping people be the best savvy savvy in Latin se ve y means to be wise and I have a couple decades now, you get older know he started chungking things in decades under my belt of.

Michelle Backes: Doing chaplain work and studying the Bible and applying it in practical ways to one’s life my life, and I just kept getting some calls and people hey do you have a card didn’t have a car, do you have a website nope so I put that together during this time and.

Michelle Backes: i’m really excited we had a event, this weekend actually took five professional women they took Friday off work and we had a savvy you adventure and it was fantastic went up North we went outside, even though it was 15 below.

Michelle Backes: That it oh shoot and.

David Horsager: And everything else right.

Michelle Backes: yeah mountain bike the place where we stayed had some fat tire fat bikes and it was a it was great so we we body stretched you know and and exercise, and we also soul stretched and so savvy you is a safe place to.

Michelle Backes: share and work on your heart.

Michelle Backes: yeah we’re doing and look at leadership from a from a biblical perspective.

David Horsager: You know, you also you also said some creative stuff in there, like you stopped in an art studio right, you are, that was a part of it, what and that you said, people came alive before that we were talking about people came alive with that I think that’s so.

David Horsager: That that creativity that almost inner child I you know i’m working with sometimes some of the toughest edge leaders in the world, in some ways it’s like.

David Horsager: You give them a space to like be creative and almost you know change it up a little bit where they can take their Armor off and they come alive, but tell me what did you guys do that way.

Michelle Backes: So it was kind of opening a new one woman, I didn’t know any of these other women.

Michelle Backes: And again, like I said all leaders strong very intelligent women kind of probably curious what are, what are we going what’s the savvy you and so that was our first stop, and it was at Pam Anderson she’s in town up here in lindstrom and we did a.

Michelle Backes: project with coasters and alcohol Inc but not like tattoo and alcohol, it was actually it’s a it’s a neat medium and.

Michelle Backes: If you mess up on these tiles you could throw it, you know, take the paper towel and wipe it off and throw it down on the ground, and that was the first thing that we started doing and then Pam they’re like where should we put these and Pam goes oh.

Michelle Backes: just throw it on the ground and it became this playful like when in our life, do we ever just.

David Horsager: throws on.

Michelle Backes: The ground and I tell you what that’s gonna be something in leadership even that i’m going to share like in metaphorically throw it on the ground.

Michelle Backes: Like we I always want to make sure the dishes are in bed, you know don at night and just we can get so driven and type A like.

Michelle Backes: Strong on the ground and by the end we were laughing just because it was fun even throughout the weekend at this cabin were like just throw it on the ground will get it later.

Michelle Backes: yeah we freaking.

David Horsager: love it.

Michelle Backes: yeah so that was when I was a fun playful creative play is so important.

David Horsager: Because the.

Michelle Backes: programming of all of us, took the edge off.

David Horsager: Well you’re an expert for us on the learning front and we’ve appreciated the transformative work you’ve done in many and even helping us be better and better and better here at trusted leadership Institute, but you talk a lot about the heart of leadership what what’s that mean.

Michelle Backes: You know that’s actually something i’ve incorporated into the savvy you and I know I keep pushing you at the trust edge like.

Michelle Backes: hey but what about people that are these leaders are freaking out with anxiety and they’re not sleeping and they’re not throwing stuff on the ground, once in a while and.

Michelle Backes: Two things on that that have been significant to me with the heart really quickly, I have a brother in law that.

Michelle Backes: I have there’s five brother in law’s and they’re all my husband’s a big guy and they’re all big strong eagle scout kind of guys and one two of them were in Hawaii snorkeling a couple years ago and.

Michelle Backes: There they were out pretty far and they the one brothers like i’m having a hard time breathing and he’s very athletic played college football.

Michelle Backes: And you for sure, because they’re conscientious eagle scouts you don’t stand on a coral reef that’s just like a you don’t do it.

Michelle Backes: And the one brother who was in the navy Academy, you know say you got to stand here so by long story short, he when he got home to the.

Michelle Backes: 48 mainland he went to a doctor appointment and had to get some things checked out and they looked at his heart and he said to the doctor what is that underneath my heart.

Michelle Backes: And he goes no the thing above was his heart he had an aneurysm that was 9.6 centimeters wide your aunt your aorta is about two centimeters.

Michelle Backes: All that to say the back offices and all the boys, especially all the cousins.

Michelle Backes: And nieces and nephews everybody had to get their heart checked another brother had to have open so to have metal open heart surgery because of this, and we also have a neighbor a couple doors down that he had was.

Michelle Backes: needed a heart transplant us on list for a long time, and he finally got a heart transplant in me, I mean he had the elven BAT vest and everything you think I all this attention we put on the heart medically yeah do we do it in leadership.

Michelle Backes: Do we talk about it, we have in, and so, even when RON my husband works with a lot of coaches and doesn’t matter if it’s high school coaches or divisional and coaches.

Michelle Backes: When he was kind of going through some of this heart stuff he was talking to them about anxiety and sleep and they’re like I don’t sleep.

Michelle Backes: yeah my heart pounds and you start kind of getting under the hood of leaders, and I think there’s a veneer that we need to be careful about ignoring me.

Michelle Backes: When I talking about the heart of leadership, I want to look under there.

Michelle Backes: And on the savvy you whether it’s individual or a group retreat me it’s not all just group settings In fact I got an email yesterday.

Michelle Backes: which was I just went oh just what it says it says, I am interested in a soul here, Michelle I am interested in a solo adventure.

Michelle Backes: preferably a malt ID i’ve been struggling with my faith for quite some time now and i’m having trouble finding my way back let’s go in her courage and her humility mean when do we do that.

David Horsager: hmm.

Michelle Backes: You know, and one of the tools this I know there’s a trusted leaders show, and one of the tools that.

Michelle Backes: i’ve incorporated in I didn’t make this up, you can find it out there on the Internet i’m sure, but it works great for marriage works great for individuals works great with your kids is called phantom have you heard of it.

David Horsager: I haven’t.

Michelle Backes: FA n O s it’s a Greek word and it means to shed light into and so.

Michelle Backes: we’re getting personal here now we’re on i’ll do this round i’ll do this before we we go to bed and.

Michelle Backes: we’ll just run through funnels we set it up where one person goes through it and the other person just receives.

Michelle Backes: You don’t say anything you have you know you’re not going to be interrupted but it’s just a way to kind of clear out the arteries, if you will.

Michelle Backes: And so F any you try to keep it brief F is for feelings identify and share a feeling.

Michelle Backes: And we do this in the savvy you to eat because, how do you feel I don’t know well there’s eight primary emotions.

Michelle Backes: But you can there’s wheels out there, that you can Google that we use to identify what if i’m just so mad or what are you, and if you spend it on you find out i’m really disappointed.

Michelle Backes: it’s a lot easier to deal with disappointment than just mad, and I think that’s part of the heart work so feelings, the F for fantasy is feeling identify a word to how you’re feeling and it’s not about.

Michelle Backes: us in our relationship, it could be, and I feel relieved I just finished, a big project or whatever so it’s not always interpersonal either.

Michelle Backes: You could do this at work, you know what’s a feeling, you have, knowing that people are going to contain you.

Michelle Backes: that’s a that’s a big word to is containment so fsu feel as for a firm given affirmation to each other, all we need that.

Michelle Backes: That helps clear out the heart arteries, if you will, and is identify a need and again it’s not necessarily from the other person I need to finish my New Zealand travel book for my mom.

Michelle Backes: i’m not gonna tell you what year we went to New Zealand right but I need to finish that so that’s a neat it could be, I need you know.

Michelle Backes: You to notice that the meals have been on the table last three days in a row, and three for three and it’s an empty nest.

Michelle Backes: So feeling it’s your F is for a firm Ennis for a need identify a need all is for ownership and we’ve racked it ratcheted up.

Michelle Backes: This year is an empty nesters part of this great reset as extreme ownership oh man.

Michelle Backes: But a leader owns it we you, you know you’ve mentioned that and and spoken on that and some of your things don’t leaders lead by sharing mistakes.

Michelle Backes: and be involved, you know transparent with that so extreme ownership for something again it doesn’t have to be interpersonal it can be something that happened at work or whatever, and then the the S can be a success.

Michelle Backes: to celebrate, because we need to do that, especially now and that’s good for the heart to have someone celebrate and have a safe place where you can go hey I Iraq this.

Michelle Backes: You know paper that I had to rating for school or whatever, or it can be for sobriety and i’m it that can be something if you know hey i’m trying to lay off.

Michelle Backes: Chocolate comes to mind after valentine’s day or i’m trying to you know lay off something else um and how well we did you can kind of have an accountability piece with that so that’s really good for the heart.

Michelle Backes: Number One way of checking on on a heart of a leader.

Michelle Backes: I I want people not even I want I guess for myself and my desire for leaders is that they lay their head on the pillow and can sleep.

Michelle Backes: and feel good.

David Horsager: I see it all the time yep you know I remember, working with one leader that’s like you know said privately to me and he’s a hard edge.

David Horsager: Top of a massive organization everybody listening would know and he said to me privately one thing he said was he put his hand on my shoulder one time and said I trust you know it’s like getting a French kiss I mean the guy just doesn’t.

David Horsager: mean that.

David Horsager: Like you know, he was just like he but he said, you know it’s kind of that imposter syndrome, where you just said, I wake up every day with a pit in my stomach with the weight of this.

David Horsager: company and the problems, and all this on me every single day, and I think you know.

David Horsager: We talked about a lot if your if your source of strength is only in your work you’re worse at work you’re not doing as well at work right so.

David Horsager: that’s that’s awesome so the savvy you this place to become wiser it’s I love the experiential learning.

David Horsager: piece of it, I love the throw it on the ground and now we’ve got an idea and fan oh sweet, we might come around to some other ideas but let’s talk about some other things for a minute.

David Horsager: You know you’ve been part of the w nba for a long time you’ve had me and then i’ve gotten to speak there and it’s been kind of fun, but you’ve seen some great championship what’s that.

Michelle Backes: it’s only been kind of fun.

David Horsager: it’s been really fun.

yeah.

David Horsager: Actually, that championship.

David Horsager: That was that was amazing my whole family got to be there for that and wow that was an unbelievable.

David Horsager: But um you know you see the the the the the Minnesota lynx they have the most tied with the most championships and web history.

David Horsager: You see, the other winners, I mean your your husband Olympian both of you athletes and former athletes and your your.

David Horsager: You know kids as athletes, and all this you’ve seen championship teams and I just think kind of thing you know from a little bit away to here.

David Horsager: Then you’ve mentored a whole lot of leaders and coached a whole lot of leaders so let’s first what what seems to be there when the team when it’s a championship team what’s what’s common to that, what do you see.

Michelle Backes: Well, from surface you see camaraderie winning covers a multitude of things, by the way.

Michelle Backes: yeah you see joy in the game you don’t see selfishness you don’t care, who gets the bucket and whoever does get the bucket you see love and.

Michelle Backes: And a lot of laughter and if your heart, whether you’re a basketball player or a leader, a mom moms and dads are leaders, so our freshman in high school leaders.

Michelle Backes: But if you don’t have joy and laughter in your life.

Michelle Backes: you’re not going to win a championship or on your team, so I see the laughter I see the camaraderie the humor and.

Michelle Backes: A light a lightness and they don’t take themselves too seriously because they become one and I behind the scenes, especially with coach Shell reeves a I know she is very, very prepared and so there’s a preparedness that that champions have.

David Horsager: love it.

Michelle Backes: mm hmm.

David Horsager: You you know you’ve done a lot of mentoring and coaching even on the side and leadership in life, what what.

David Horsager: I would like to jump into that even a little what makes a great mentor of your a lot of people there’s a lot of mentorship programs in companies and you see some fall flat what what makes a great mentor or even a great mentor relationship or Program.

Michelle Backes: You know, I guess, the first thing that comes to mind on that is a great mentor is also being mentored.

Michelle Backes: Maybe Chapel on the big four I had mount rushmore up there and.

Michelle Backes: talked about you need to have these big for in your life, whether your mentor or mentee or a leader in general and.

Michelle Backes: Coming from a Chapel and perspective I call it who’s your Paul who someone teaching you who is your Timothy someone that you are pouring into who is your barnabas and barnabas is a biblical.

Michelle Backes: Is the storage biblical person that was an encourager too many you need to have that and then, who is your Nathan and Nathan, is the one that went to King David and confronted him on a little issue that he had.

Michelle Backes: Right now Samuel swap us.

David Horsager: So you’ve got your encourage your your confronting.

Michelle Backes: Your confront your yeah.

David Horsager: Your your come alongside your kind of your peer and you’re wise.

Michelle Backes: When you’re pulling into yeah.

David Horsager: yep yep okay those.

Are.

David Horsager: The four.

Michelle Backes: So I think that’s that’s a huge part of mentorship it’s not just one way and there’s some humility that comes with that too, so when i’m working with someone I mentoring.

Michelle Backes: i’m saying hey I just learned that three months ago from the person I am you know and i’m 30 years older than you this is great for you get this and you know, working with the girl at Notre Dame Oh, I wish I would have this in college.

David Horsager: You know, I see a lot of.

David Horsager: Some people make it too hard and they’re like it’s this is gonna be a program you got to commit to 50 times a month, they don’t do this to get to that, I mean that’s a little exaggeration, but it’s like.

David Horsager: It becomes so hard that people don’t last they meet once they do this they do howdy and I can say you know i’ve been mentored by one meeting you know for sure, but I think some of these.

David Horsager: More lasting relationships there’s some value to that too, but how do you how do you set it up for success, I guess.

Michelle Backes: You know I think communication of expectations is huge.

Michelle Backes: I can’t make myself someone’s mentor per se and I don’t like it if i’m become someone has made me their mentee, so I think you need to communicate hey what’s your.

Michelle Backes: once every two weeks, you know what, what do you, what are your expectations, you have to be fluid and.

Michelle Backes: In my perspective, as the as if i’m in the role of a mentor they they guide the time schedule.

David Horsager: you’ve seen some leaders you’ve mentored some even that or are champions or TEAM members that have fallen off the cliff they failed miserably and even publicly what what are some of the traps of these leaders, what would you, you know if you had it.

David Horsager: If you could have told them something ahead of time or, if you could have if you’re going to tell our leaders trust the leads, how are you going to stay trusted like how are you going to keep from.

David Horsager: You know, falling off the cliff.

Michelle Backes: get a tribe.

Michelle Backes: get some or one person that you can be yourself that you can take off your shoes and go i’m a mess, right now, and I know I just posted something on instagram.

Michelle Backes: 40 minutes ago, and I was super high and this but inside and make someone who can, I think the ones who fall off the cliff they have a bigger chasm between their reality and who they really are and so, if you need to come with me and Pam.

Michelle Backes: Dirty paper towels on the floor and just let it let it loose the facade and social media, I think, is the trap, to answer your question I think that’s a.

Michelle Backes: You know, we take ourselves way too serious sometimes.

David Horsager: You know, we watched you go through speaking of that meeting a tribe, and we all do we talked about here, you know the the great leaders ask for seek feedback right they seek healthy accountability and.

David Horsager: Creating creating healthy accountability is significant, but you’ve gone through some challenges I you know I.

David Horsager: It was i’m going to pick one for you.

Because.

David Horsager: So I mean your daughter she’s a recruit at many significant schools to play ball she.

David Horsager: You know she gets recruited by a big 10 school and scholarship, and all this and she basically never plays a day and it’s a couple year process and surgeries and kind of she she’s become this she’s this amazing basketball Star and it’s kind of all taken away.

David Horsager: Well, what did you how did you coach them, because this is different, this is personal right, this is, we got a lot of people, we talked to here that are CEOs and are.

David Horsager: You know leaders have actually pro sports things you’ve had on or you know huge massive followings whatever but everybody this this gets, how do we be a trusted leader, then, how do we do it at home.

David Horsager: yeah, how do we do it when it’s really challenging on us and hurts us.

Michelle Backes: Right yeah it’s firing on all cylinders you grieve many times i’m like I wish it was my need.

Michelle Backes: You know I wish it could be me she had five surgeries and her last game that she ever played in ended in the i’m going to keep it.

Michelle Backes: above water here and in a standing ovation by everybody in the whole gym how cool is that to because she loved the game, and she played it well, if I can honor my daughter.

Michelle Backes: In that respect, and then to go from rehabbing to every letter of the you know the prescriptive PT plan and not it not work.

Michelle Backes: And so it was hard and I, at times, I just was at a conference RON and I were at and we heard something within in this realm that I didn’t always do well, because after the third surgery.

Michelle Backes: You get how bad is it that you get good at surgeries you know, but the feelings is sometimes that our art.

Michelle Backes: You know if any aren’t expressed get driven down and getting driven down, but in this conference, they said, if you want any communication tip he said match emotion with emotion and fact with fact.

Michelle Backes: So, how did that go with the Bacchus house there’s all there’s a lot of emotions we’re all passionate people and sometimes because I didn’t even want to tap into my emotions for there’s a I would answer with fact I mean not.

Michelle Backes: mean like oh i’m so sorry but you got to give up basketball someday look at me i’m not playing you know but that’s not what she wanted to hear.

Michelle Backes: Again and again, and she knew it and she just needed me to sit in the well with her, so how did that go it’s tough and it’s you know it’s it’s hard but.

Michelle Backes: You have to communicate through it hardship so she’s an amazing woman and I we don’t know the end of the story, yet, but she’s going to speech pathology and communication disorders and.

Michelle Backes: i’m she can identify with the struggles that these young and old people that she’s going to work with she’s gonna have a depth of compassion so anyway, how do we your question was what it gets caught in an emotion David you went there you went to.

David Horsager: i’m just asking you know how do you how do you lead through that I mean in essence you’re leaving your daughter through something even.

David Horsager: There was a long period of time where you’re kind of leading her even though you’re serving and listening and you.

David Horsager: You spoke to it by just sitting with her, but you know she’s her own she’s an adult she was a college student.

David Horsager: But you’re but you’re you know, through a time of life when she has to make a decision, and it was like.

David Horsager: An over and over and over was i’m going to take this and then i’m going to go back and then I know i’m gonna go back next year and then i’ll play one game, or whatever I it just doesn’t work out doesn’t heal yeah.

David Horsager: um but any words of advice on you know leading others through tough times walking with them how how did you do it.

Michelle Backes: You know I think it’s.

David Horsager: Or how would you do differently.

Michelle Backes: I would, I just think it’s really important and i’ve often wondered, even in the counseling and working with some of these women in the w nba that have.

Michelle Backes: Major.

Michelle Backes: issues, I have not had a relative get shot.

Michelle Backes: Or, I have not experienced some of these things that many people have do I have to experience that to be able to you know, help them and lead them through adversity was knee surgery or whatever, and I also have heard a great definition of empathy and sympathy so as a leader in.

Michelle Backes: be aware of where you are in reference to the well and if there’s a while and someone’s don’t in it, and these surgeries kept bringing Carmen own into the well.

Michelle Backes: If you will physically and emotionally where you are you at the top saying oh it’s too bad and then there’s times, where we send sympathy here’s a sandwich, but if you if you want to connect depend on your relationship with that with that person get in the well with them.

Michelle Backes: We play a game that we made up in our House just called shoes, if you know when the kids were younger they were trying having a hard time understanding a perspective on something I said, shoes, and we would go okay What would it be like.

Michelle Backes: To be there, how cold go through our senses, you know, would it be called there was it, what do you think they felt and it, I think that level and depth of empathy is huge would go into well.

Michelle Backes: Go on the wall just sit with them and be okay with silence.

David Horsager: that’s awesome, this is a good, this is a.

David Horsager: You know, shoes, what if our one of our world would that would have our What if our.

David Horsager: Government would do that what if we just say pause for a second hey let me get in your shoes for real, let me, let me be in the shoes of the person is, you have the constituents, you have the you know.

David Horsager: What if in business, we could really get in the shoes of our employees and and you know what if we could get really getting the shoes of that person across the table negotiating with me.

David Horsager: I love that great mentors are mentored get in the well with the with others and shoes, what is it really feel like to be in your shoes love it.

David Horsager: So great leaders tend to have good habits on a regular basis, and I know you have some, but how do you how do you Kate you know.

David Horsager: it’s really hard to lead others if we’re not leading ourselves to some degree, even in perfectly as we try to what are some of the habits of Michelle Bacchus oh boy.

Michelle Backes: Well, I think, especially in this great reset, we are not driving the Games, you know we I just all of a sudden 50% of our household.

Michelle Backes: and habits and routines have been changed, so one of the things that RON and I did we have a we kind of set our morning routine and that that sets us so speaking very freely for me I.

Michelle Backes: I don’t let my feet hit the ground until i’ve said a praise to my creator and.

Michelle Backes: that’s a Sarah girls Minnesota artists, is a friend of ours RON worked with her and she taught at rules month and she has a song about that me the first time that a seeing be a priest my God and came so I start with that that’s I have it and effect doesn’t just.

Michelle Backes: start the day on the right or left foot depending with lancers and then, and then I have, I do a quiet time I do reading a reading.

Michelle Backes: From my from my Bible, and another book if i’m if i’m got another thing going, and then I do my exercise, so I get my clothes my workout clothes on right away i’m.

Michelle Backes: Keeping it real.

Michelle Backes: I am in my workout clothes, sometimes at three o’clock and I won’t make my can’t change until I do it because, so if I have a podcast this morning.

David Horsager: yeah tell me this you know we’re all getting different ideas here, you know me i’ve lost.

David Horsager: One point lost 50 pounds or so, in five months and but it’s a work its work every day for me still 10 years later, it is work every day for me.

David Horsager: To seek to be physically healthy and I love the spiritual and other piece of health to marital health all that relational health all these things are critical and i’m passionate about, but what is a routine for you exercise wise what is something that’s a common way that you stay fit.

Michelle Backes: I am I just finished yesterday, the I did i’m doing beachbody I did a beachbody routine say did the 100 day I just finished 100 yesterday.

Michelle Backes: So I was awesome because then I don’t have to think about is it upper body lower body or running so.

Michelle Backes: I did two miles on the treadmill and I did day 100 and they’re anywhere from 27 to 32 minutes, except for day 100 which I have an allotted for was 53 minutes and i’m just going to keep it real as like no.

Michelle Backes: plan on a few 50 so.

David Horsager: what’s next.

Michelle Backes: That helps that helps.

Michelle Backes: Right I just I just ran on the treadmill today and that’s not my thing to figure out.

David Horsager: Now you gotta figure out your next.

David Horsager: row I.

Michelle Backes: love it, I do have a subscription to this beachbody platform and he has 115 other options.

Michelle Backes: sure.

David Horsager: So here you go.

David Horsager: What you got I think the biggest thing actually is not very often what you do it’s finding something that you will do it’s like what is it you will do tomorrow, every day, what what will you do consistently right yeah that’s that’s a big challenge for for many so.

David Horsager: What are you learning these days about leadership.

Michelle Backes: Oh man I just I love learning I.

Michelle Backes: Currently i’m in a leadership group a tip tones in leadership program for one year, once a month, a group of us get together and it’s focused on the book people fuel.

Michelle Backes: By john Townsend and it talks about what kind of fruit, do we want you know if you have a tree and what kind of fruit, do you want, in your life looks at the core and the the thing i’m learning right now about leadership is in the soil, he has a term that he talks about 22 nutrients.

Michelle Backes: That all.

Michelle Backes: All need, and you can have vision, and you can have drive and if you don’t have some people skills or aren’t receiving and contributing nutrients you’re not going to have the fruit on the top of the tree so that’s what i’m learning right now about the nutrients and.

Michelle Backes: And so being empty nest i’m not sharing this with carbon and Bo i’m talking with RON so poor guy is getting all the stuff but even.

Michelle Backes: Like I mentioned earlier containment is a great word just one of the nutrients, so I I was part of another leadership thing that I was.

Michelle Backes: A model that I wanted to process with ronnie said okay let’s try this out of quadrants one or you know.

Michelle Backes: Can you just contain I mean it sounds so wrote but we’re trying to part of my homework is to understand these words, would you just can teen this topic, you know not fix not suggest another you know give advice and.

Michelle Backes: he’s like sure, so I go through this whole thing and i’m wrestling with this and they i’d like to see it this way, and so, by the end and he got into it too is like you know you should really call that that that up, it was like we kind of laugh but that’s not containing.

Michelle Backes: So I mean I didn’t again we’re learning this, but he would have been I I tried to share, and you know, a need and it’s how often do we do that in leadership.

David Horsager: So true.

Michelle Backes: So that’s something i’m working on.

David Horsager: There is lots here containment winning covers a multitude of sins, I like that one that’s so true on teams great mentors are mentored.

David Horsager: And a whole lot more the shoes I love it hey it’s time for the lightning round quick answers to questions you’re ready for this like playing lightning and basketball here we go a favorite book or resource right now.

Michelle Backes: um well people feel I mentioned, I know before I got going on savvy you, I am a Bob golf fan, and I read dream big and.

Michelle Backes: it’s a late read but it’s a good one.

Michelle Backes: And finally, after out loud.

David Horsager: You know I just remembered because I love it, you know we read his first love does, we read that as a family in the evenings what fun right.

David Horsager: And I didn’t remember we’re going to ask another question you’ve been an amazing partner and consultant senior consultant for trusted leadership institute you’ve had some experiences here you’ve been.

David Horsager: joined us in the passion of this work, but a couple highlights or impactors or transformations or insights that you see to this eight pillar framework eight pillars of trust in the work we’re trying to do here.

Michelle Backes: You know, actually David i’m glad you brought that up because one up probably a high and it’s also an adventure That was my first international trip and I went to Bermuda.

Michelle Backes: And we, I did four days over there and it wasn’t just doing a keynote or a training session then you’re gone, we were living with them, and my mom my mom actually came as as well and she’s a trusted leader and in her own right and so.

David Horsager: Just to be clear was first it was first international trip through trust edge.

David Horsager: Through us yeah for us yep.

Michelle Backes: yeah yeah.

David Horsager: first time we first time we sent overseas.

Michelle Backes: first time you sent me, obviously.

David Horsager: yeah love it.

Michelle Backes: was a great first place um but what I was amazed at how this framework different culture and island, all the same it doesn’t matter it doesn’t matter this this.

Michelle Backes: These eight pillars work for men and women, young and old w nba teams, or the university at Bermuda in their leadership and because it was it in more of an immersion you know, we had a.

Michelle Backes: meal, one of the nights it ended up in in tears kind of to this point of allowing people to talk about it and look at things.

Michelle Backes: And, and the screen where gave vocabulary to like a lot of haha yes, that is what we’re missing and they could identify in a X Ray kind of format what their issues were.

Michelle Backes: So that was a That was a highlight to see it.

Michelle Backes: implemented and people really gather around it and then put it into practice.

David Horsager: Right so fun and so funny to hear back from them of the impact we have some more we’re doing with them, even after code, but.

David Horsager: I also am reminded there’s there’s so many differently you’ve done business and you’ve done all these different but.

David Horsager: One of the groups, you with fire chiefs right or fire, you know fire across our whole state, you did kind of a trusted roadshow all these different fire chief groups anything from that and I didn’t ask you ahead of time i’m just wondering that was just a fun experience.

Michelle Backes: yeah talk about leaders and talk about courageous men and women.

Michelle Backes: And it was interesting because we were in five different spots all across this across the state.

Michelle Backes: And the importance of trust can help your relationship in a classroom or it can save a life.

Michelle Backes: and not to get too dramatic, but they are on the front lines and trust is important in basketball you won’t be on the floor if you don’t trust you.

Michelle Backes: it’s important everywhere, but it is also a the work that we do with the trust edge is is changing and saving lives it’s ready and you didn’t even.

David Horsager: There we go that.

Michelle Backes: Only 20 under the table leader.

David Horsager: There yo.

Michelle Backes: He seriously it so what I learned from them, but just the.

Michelle Backes: Again, they have the vocabulary and to have to learn the discipline and how important it is for them to be trusted.

Michelle Backes: yeah with each other.

David Horsager: fun that was it’s just been a fun relationship there to hear about all that still happening there and the common language and the tools and you really spearheaded that work on our behalf and i’m grateful for that.

David Horsager: So back to a little lightning round here best advice or quote these days.

Michelle Backes: best advice that I would share is and i’ve been really thinking about it is to have a little person in your life.

Michelle Backes: i’d go eight years and younger and if you don’t have one find one they’ll bring us right back I I remember what i’m going on a walk with in the fall and.

Michelle Backes: run into some neighborhoods we hadn’t seen that very much and we were talking to them and said Oh, is this your toy yeah but we can’t go over here on the lawn she said, because my dad just sanitize it she’s for instead of fertilized sanitize it.

Michelle Backes: Oh she’s trying to make sense or my niece.

Michelle Backes: We all face time because she’s doing the recorder so we’re all excited to listen to Ingrid do the recorder, and all of a sudden, she starts going like this, she played the recorder out of her right nostril I mean.

Michelle Backes: quickly forget about the challenge there so that would be my advice.

Michelle Backes: Get.

Michelle Backes: them young kids and throw some something down throw your not not a media dirty napkin on your floor per se, but for something on the floor relax and do some creative play boy that’s three.

Michelle Backes: Yes, I love it.

David Horsager: that’s it that’s free of charge appreciate that.

David Horsager: One thing left for you or one hope for the future.

Michelle Backes: One thing left for me personally professionally, can I ask a follow up question.

David Horsager: You can answer, however you’d like.

Michelle Backes: Okay i’ll go i’ll go back to habits i’ll go one thing that i’m working on, especially because, because when you do start a new venture, it can sprawl so.

Michelle Backes: narrow scope i’m working on having a hard stop time to my day without this emptiness beans I don’t have to have supper on at a certain time, or you know I I need to work, personally, I had, for me, is working on a hard stop time, so we can play.

David Horsager: You go every night every day now like know we’re running kids around to sports are going to university sports or whatever right so wow.

David Horsager: Well hey before I get.

David Horsager: what’s that.

Michelle Backes: Your time will come.

David Horsager: Oh, my.

Michelle Backes: I love everything I just it’s it’s a change.

Michelle Backes: So.

Michelle Backes: The things i’m working on in the future is that i’ve identified as having to stop time.

David Horsager: love it.

David Horsager: wow this went fast, we have before we get to the final question where can people find out about Michelle Bacchus and savvy you.

Michelle Backes: hey come check out the thc savvy you letter u.com the savvy u.com.

David Horsager: This will be in the show notes, and you can see it at trusted leader show.com it’ll be all there and how to find Michelle backus Thank you so much for being on I got will have one more question for you it’s the trusted leader show who is a leader you trust and why.

Michelle Backes: Well there’s several not to do the family mom thing I trust my Mr we’re talking about the links, I really try would trust my and more she’s younger than me.

Michelle Backes: And that’s exciting to meet and older there’s young women out there, she left the game at the top of your game for things that she was pursuing.

Michelle Backes: And that were even bigger than basketball and she’s the real deal and it’s fun when you’re around people that are the real deal that walk your talk so I trust her that’s.

Michelle Backes: I learned her, especially when it comes to racial reconciliation and.

Michelle Backes: see that, so my Mr.

David Horsager: My Mr one of the many you could have named, thank you for that so you’ll find everything in the show notes, this has been a treat Michelle, thank you for the work you do for trusted leadership Institute.

David Horsager: i’m excited about the work you’re doing, and with this newish venture and adventure and savvy you, and thanks for being an example, the so many and mentoring so many for good i’m so grateful you’ve made us better and we just so grateful for you as a friend to so thank you.

Michelle Backes: Thank you, David, thank you for your leadership.

Michelle Backes: Thank you yeah.

David Horsager: you’ve been listening to the trusted leader show thanks so much until next time stay trusted.